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comment by theadvancedapes
theadvancedapes  ·  4072 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: What about morals?

Ok, let's clean this up a little bit.

First - morality is not uniquely human. All organisms that live in social groups have an evolved moral code based on their evolved value system (i.e., what they find pleasurable/sensually enjoyable). Every social animal needs a moral code to facilitate social cohesion and group stability. The more agents you have in a system - the more complex the moral code must be to facilitate higher levels of ordered stability.

Second - You cannot say that just because natural selection and fitness govern biological change, that therefore everything in nature is kill or be killed. The entire biological world is based off of a quid-pro-quo (a "you scratch my back I'll scratch yours"). Scientifically this is called reciprocal altruism and a number of glorious biological phenomena emerge from these interactions. Is everything at base selfish? Yes, but cooperation evolves from competition. In fact, socio-technological evolution has a long arc towards eliminating competition using metasystem transitions (i.e., when a new level of order is stabilized the smaller agents that formed the larger collective overwhelmingly cooperate and eliminate "free riders"). This is in the process of happening in our species. We are far more moral than we have ever been. We are far more cooperative than we have ever been. This is dictated by the amount of energy in our system. If no one wants for anything on Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs - no one needs to compete. Most of our competition is now not related to natural selection. We compete, but if we lose, we don't die.

Finally - We are in charge of our morals. We culturally construct our morals. The enlightenment philosophers got it right. The only thing that is important in life is consciousness. Everyone's individual consciousness is precious and unique. Our morals therefore should be constructed around the principle that you should never harm another consciousness. You can do whatever else you like - just don't fuck with anyone else's experience in life.

Hope that helped insomniasexx





bioemerl  ·  3818 days ago  ·  link  ·  

"Finally - We are in charge of our morals. We culturally construct our morals. The enlightenment philosophers got it right. The only thing that is important in life is consciousness. Everyone's individual consciousness is precious and unique. Our morals therefore should be constructed around the principle that you should never harm another consciousness. You can do whatever else you like - just don't fuck with anyone else's experience in life."

Not really.

Morales, as I see them, are things impressed and imposed on people by society in order to have all actors in society know and act by a certain beneficial set of rules.

Don't kill, don't steal, etc.

It has nothing to do with preservation of consciousness. A human consciousness is no different than a pig consciousness or an ant consciousness. The only thing that makes us unique is our ability to contribute and be part of society in some fashion. This includes the disabled, the elderly, etc, as living and being able to speak, or even just having value to those around you who love you is enough to consider you as a contribution to society. It's not all about labor.

Don't screw with others because you don't want others to screw with you. Morals are impressed on everyone in society, so you have to assume that your moral code applies to EVERYONE acting around you. So don't litter, don't pirate, don't pop the children's soccer balls. It has nothing to do with protecting consciousness. It's all about that bitter, greedy, wonderful, sense of self preservation.