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comment by coffeesp00ns
coffeesp00ns  ·  3962 days ago  ·  link  ·    ·  parent  ·  post: Hubski, what's your motto?

Thanks for _refugee_ for the redirect, otherwise I wouldn't have seen this, and I think I need to address it.

Frankly, I posted the picture I posted for a few reasons, some that I were a gut-reaction, and left it up for others.

I posted it in direct reaction to resukureipuru's post because I

1.) felt that I got what was intended by the motto ( the idea of overstepping or pushing past ones own insecurity and fear)

2.) felt, once again, a desire to be accepted by my peers ( who in this case seemed to be would-be inhabitants of 4chan's /b/) and so posted the referenced picture for the common ground it supplied. while being in my mid-20s, I am in many ways still insecure, much to my own derision, and like anyone with that characteristic I occasionally do very stupid things to feel accepted.

Of course, I realize that the word "faggot" is inappropriate, and after sleeping on it, I considered taking down the post, especially considering I am someone who is MAAB and is currently working through whether or not I feel comfortable in my assigned gender (therapists are helpful). I could probably, by the dictionary definition of the word quoted above, be referred to as a "faggot" and would of course find it a hurtful, derogatory term.

However, and this is a big however, I left it up. my reasons are as follows:

1.) I felt that while the word and phrase used by the OP are problematic, that is how they have decided to motivate themselves and I should not judge them based on their problematic language. I see my own post as supporting that person's desire to move past their own self-placed barriers to success, phrased in this manner, or in a more PC manner.

2.) I'd already put it out into the world. I am a big believer that when you say things, they don't go away, even (or perhaps especially) online. What do I gain by removing it, when those who are offended will have already seen it and will remember it? to them my personality is already stained, and there is little I can do to improve my stature. Those who saw it and agreed with the sentiment (if not the words used) will see the missing post and wonder where it's gone. Self-censorship? Censorship by others? Shaming?

I truly feel that, while the wording used in the original motto is problematic, it was not intended to be harmful to anyone. As the cards have played out, it has been taken in that harmful way (in a manner I should have expected, considering the loaded nature of the word "faggot").

So that's the reasoning. If anyone wants me to remove the image, etc. let me know, the delete post button is one click away.





thenewgreen  ·  3962 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I'm glad I read this. I immediately un-followed those in this thread that I thought posted offensive things and in the case of OP muted/hushed, then moved on. This was days ago. It's nice to get your perspective on this, I've always enjoyed your contributions and was kind of shocked. -re-followed (but mostly because I'm looking forward to recording music with you :)

coffeesp00ns  ·  3962 days ago  ·  link  ·  

I'm glad you took the time to read it. I'm still a stupid kid occasionally, and obviously this was one of those moments where a lack of rational thought process and perspective made itself jarringly apparent. I wear that, and there's nothing I can do now but move forward and be a bigger person for it.

I'm looking forward to music as well.

_refugee_  ·  3962 days ago  ·  link  ·  

    2.) I'd already put it out into the world. I am a big believer that when you say things, they don't go away,

This is absolutely something I believe in, at least in regards to Hubski and other such communities. That said I delete things with impunity from my Twitter but that's often because I get drunk and tweet complainy, embarrassing things about boys. And I mean embarrassing in a juvenile sort of way, in a "It doesn't really matter" sort of way, as opposed to times when I have - yes - embarrassed myself here. Those times are infrequent but they have happened and even recently. b_b

I have had posts on Hubski I have thought about deleting and I have decided to let them stand because sometimes, I am an idiot. Sometimes I make a fool of myself, sometimes I lower myself to the lowest denominator in the conversation, sometimes I take the bait. In addition sometimes I bait people with arguments I know they will jump on, and take the more fallacious or foolish point of view. I can justify this by saying "I enjoy making this argument and if this person takes the other side it just forces me to fully vet and develop my point of view" but it is still an ugly conversational tactic.

I would say to let it stand as a monument to what you may now find to be a poor decision. Let us live with our shame and maybe try to learn from these experiences. Of course, you and I are both going to take from our misguided posts what we will - but we also know that they were observed and have an impact in the community besides just the person that we responded to.

Sometimes you have to live with the shit you do. You might log onto Hubski the next morning and feel embarrassed. In a way that's social policing at work, using the term "policing" as a neutral although it may sound like a negative. (Social policing is something I have thought about a lot.)

I think that the word "faggot" is loaded and should not be used. But once it has been used, deleting it is only an attempt at a cover-up. We should own up to our least flattering moments. We should have to.

b_b  ·  3962 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Why you looking at me? I never said word one that I was embarrassed by! Although I regret not making myself clear to begin with, I stand by my views.

_refugee_  ·  3962 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Ah, no, you misinterpret. I have embarrassed myself on Hubski recently and you had subtly referenced it. Here is my recanting.

Edited to say, here are my big girl pants. I promise not to lead any more people on Hubski into arguments where I know they will take what I consider to be the "wrong" side just so that I can rip into them and tell them how wrong they are.

b_b  ·  3962 days ago  ·  link  ·  

Oh you're talking about the PM in which I said that I wouldn't deface the wall here by crying and spitting fire. For the record, I did not subtly reference your earlier comment that you linked in your reply. It hadn't even crossed my at the time. It's just my philosophy based on the fact that I've never been interested enough in an internet fight to actually let someone get under my skin. I wasn't trying to call you out. Do as you please, so long as you keep doing it well.

_refugee_  ·  3941 days ago  ·  link  ·  

It's okay. That was like, my public apology. I wouldn't have brought it up if I didn't feel I needed to acknowledge it somehow.