I know mk just went MIA but I'd be curious to see how Hubski stacks up to the bar analogy. I hope that one day, we will be able to walk into the internet and get a beer.
The concept of a 'third place' has been bandied about here before. In similar vein, Ken Burns' documentary on Prohibition touches on a lot of these same issues, making the point that for immigrants who were stacked 8 to a room, the local bar was the equivalent of the living room, their attorney's office, the employment agency and the game room rolled all into one. There's a great bookstore in Seattle called "Third Place Books." I used to think they meant "behind Barnes & Noble and Borders." Once I stumbled across that "third place" thing, it clicked... because they also have a food court, a performance stage and a mini-mall of other craftspeople. It's a cool spot.
I'll definitely put that on my "When I'm in Seattle" list, thanks. I'd love to see more of that in the U.S. but I think that bars are typically thought of as "nightlife" rather than as places to socialize. Furthermore, I think a lot of towns are spread out enough that the sheer amount of travel involved in getting to an area where bars and restaurants are zoned, really undermines the living room feel. I've really enjoyed living in very walkable places and I think that cities and towns structured around pedestrians do a lot better in terms of culturing an atmosphere of socialization than their American analogs.
I recently made a trip to Scotland, and one thing I really enjoyed was that the bars fill up after work in a way that doesn't happen here. Not that people don't drink in the afternoon in the US, but it felt like more of an afternoon social meetup featuring all the neighborhood's middle aged men, quite a friendly environment actually. I love drinking, and I love bars. But I really hate (*hate*) so call night life, so that style of drinking really suited me.
Yeah, you know that whole neighborhood feel is really great, but to have that in America, I think we'd actually have to know our neighbors (in addition to having towns and cities geared toward pedestrians). This past summer, I met my parent's neighbors who have lived across the street since we moved there in 1996. First time ever. The only reason I did meet them, was because I locked myself out and needed to use a phone, as my phone was in the house. Since then, I've been conscious about making an effort to say hello to neighbors and people I see often, at the store or on the way to work, etc. Honestly, it feels a lot better. That alone makes me wonder how much I've missed out on, how many opportunities went unrealized and how much more limited my network is simply because I'd never thought to speak to people who live around me. Live and learn, I guess.
I completely agree. That's what I love about European cities, they have the feel that you're talking about (at least the one's that I've been to). Meanwhile the only place like that in the US that I've found is Boston, that was a nice surprise. I would much rather spend some time at a quieter bar with friends just relaxing, maybe playing trivia or watching a game, as opposed to at a more club-oriented bar. Unfortunately, being a college age student I'm in the minority on that opinion. kleinbl00, I've got a friend currently living in Seattle, I'll have to tell him about it in case it's accessible from his apartment.
That's the argument for "pubs" over "clubs." Having visited a couple good'n'proper English pubs as a kid, and having put myself through school mixing bands in clubs, there's no comparison. "Bars" as they existed through most of the 20th century are becoming rarer. http://www.thirdplacebooks.com There's a great scientific American article about sprawl and urban design, but I don't believe it's online.