- Now you say you're lonely
You cried the whole night through.
Well you can cry me a river, cry me a river
I cried a river over you.
I didn't exactly cry a river. I just decided that I would win this -- and winning meant staying fabulous. But I was very angry and had some difficult months and will likely have more.
On Monday night and again tonight, the ex-spousal-unit phones me. I stupidly answer. So now the love interest that he dumped me for told him (yet again) that she wants to marry someone BUT NOT HIM. Not now, not ever. He's just
not the guy.
So he's broken-hearted and suddenly realizes what a shit he's been. He doesn't seem to have many friends, he's lonely, and feels guilty -- not so much for dumping me, but for how he did it: by turning into a block of ice. . . . now melting as he cries to me on the phone.
He's seeing a therapist -- the one we briefly saw between his July 1 declaration, I want space and July 30, I'm done. He wants to find out what happened. He suggests that maybe I go with him to one of his appointments. We could "pick up the discussion where we left it in July," he says. In July, the therapist said she would not work with us unless we were both committed to working on the relationship. He wasn't.
I say, "What part of after the lawyers don't you understand?"
I don't actually say that. I'm not that mean. I say almost nothing. I don't want to be in the conversation.
Cry me a river. Cry me a river. I cried a river over you.
What can be learned?
(I don't tell him that I met a prince, but if he bothered to follow me on hubski, he would know.)
(OK, my new guy might not be a prince, but his kiss sure woke me up!)
Went to a party last week. Saw the old crowd. Included an ex (probably the worst ex) whose relationship ended on a bad note (probably the worst note). Spent 3 hours avoiding eye contact and trying not to be recognized; after all, it's been 15 years. She did, of course. Said "hi" on her way out the door. I said "hi" back. The thing is, though? It's been 15 years. And it ended badly. And fuckin'A I look good and she didn't. And that was awesome.
I had a dream about you last night, usual non-sequitor dream stuff. I bet it was because of your comment here. I'm on my way to the lawyer, as you know, and I was thinking, I'm going to make sure I look great! I better get on it.And fuckin'A I look good and she didn't.
For what it's worth, I'm finding your progress and mentality towards this whole process incredibly inspiring. In 100% of the cases I've seen up until this one, divorce is the ending of people. It is where their happiness, self-worth, and 'light' seems to sputter and die out. You're just getting started, and I've never seen you shine brighter.
I'm experiencing all this stuff as well. My parents are like that: mom asked for the divorce last year, my dad was like "what? why? I see nothing wrong with how things are now". Then they go through the legal process, mom shows up here once in a while, they fight, she sulks, dad goes after her and so on. The worst part was when they tried getting me and my brother to take sides, which I vehemently refused. I said "don't get me in the middle of your fight". That's how it used to be. Things are better now: there's still some of that attrition, but the get-the-children-to-dislike-the-other-spouse phase is over. My mom has also put more distance between her and my dad. It's tough. We get used to that person and they get used to us. Letting go is hard. In my case: - I learned to ignore my parents' bickering and to not get involved in it. - I learned to disappear from the ex's social circle when things end and not come back. People change over time, but I prefer meeting new people. - I learned to not get involved romantically with people I see often, like work. - I learned to be picky about the people I let in my world. Because of ex #1. I'm glad things are going well with the "prince"! :)What can be learned?
I courted a customer for a year and have been with her now for over a decade. Don't frivolously date people you see often but also don't shut the door on it completely, you never know... Dating seems different now a days, it's like people just throw things found on the internet at the wall to see if they stick. It's defiantly not the way to go about dating people like coworkers.
Hm. What do you mean by this?...it's like people just throw things found on the internet at the wall to see if they stick.
I've known people who click through dating/mating apps and go on dates with three or four different people a week. Hell I've known people who will scheduled three dates in an evening, if the first one is going well they will cancel the next two and so on. I suppose it's playing the odds, dating like you are buying a lottery ticket, you never know the next one might be a winner. The cold ask out of a person you just met or didn't even know was always there but it seems like people are more like to go for the quick and shallow date without much meaning attached to it than they ever were before. I don't know if I'm saying this at all well. If you go on one hundred dates a year you might look at going on a date with a coworker with little consideration of the consequences. It's just another date. All dates are just another date, nothing to em, just push through em like enemies in a video game until you find a golden chest. You used to only be able to date people you knew and consequently would have to gauge the social or work related consequences of who you were going to go out with more carefully than an average tinder date. You had to weigh the relative merits of the person and how they related to your world with some care (not necessarily some kind of extraordinary care but it mattered). There was always the cold ask out of a person you met while at a book store, the bar or a show but there were way less of these people to hook up with than there are now that the internet has aggregated demand. Now a days you can go on three dates in a night or one hundred dates in a year even if you are less than the studliest guy or more desirable girl around. You don't have to try and suss out how compatible a person is, what your friends would think if you started seeing her, if Donna would still consider going out with you if she knew you went out on a date with Susan. You can just date your ass off, separate the wheat from the chaff as you find them. No worries about if your compatible, do you share the same tastes, does their laugh annoy the shit out of you. The consensus of people I've seen who date hard and often is that you should know in the first ten to twenty minutes if a person is worth your time. No more working up the nerve or deciding if your really interested. It's a different world.
chuckle That's the reason I don't date coworkers, right there. :D Basically, I think the risk is too big for that setting. It can get nasty when you go on a date, get to know the person and end things badly. It's worse when you have to see that person every single day. At its worst they treat you as if you didn't exist. At best, you can still be kind-of-friends. Regardless, the whole workplace is going to know about it. Anyway, I'm glad it worked for you! :) Moving on: chuckle² I think so too. There's a couple points I'd wish to put here: 1- I grew up in an open, "aggressive" dating culture. Brazilians tend to move things fast. You meet the person you want, ask them out, kiss on the first date usually (or even before the first date), and so on. There's still the tradition of the man asking the girl out, so girls get a lot of attention. The biggest part of it is unwanted attention. 2- I've never tried online dating before and I don't feel like doing so right now because I'm VERY paranoid about privacy. Just so I don't seem too much like an alien, I had some... caliente talks, for lack of a better word... on IRC and some online games. It was always the other person who initiated it. I'd just show up, say "Hi, how are you?" and that was it! There were some e-penpals too last year. So, this is where I come from. I don't know anything about dating in the US, except for what I read. On a side note, I wonder how Coffee Meets Bagel, Bumble, Happn and Once are doing right now. When is Tinder going to be overtaken? What's next?You used to only be able to date people you knew and consequently would have to gauge the social or work related consequences of who you were going to go out with more carefully than an average tinder date.
You had to weigh the relative merits of the person and how they related to your world with some care
There was always the cold ask out of a person you met while at a book store, the bar or a show but there were way less of these people to hook up with than there are now that the internet has aggregated demand.
Your post makes me feel so many emotions... But aww yeah for the kiss! Hubski is here to help. Put on some music (or this or this... whatever makes ya feel fierce), order yourself something fancy... and enjoy some good pizza and wine. Maybe check out a goofy bird to cheer yourself up. Or two. You do you, lil. Keep strong! :)
I've tried calling my ex three times in the last three months. I marvel at her fortitude. How does she not pick up, I don't know. I went on a blind date last week. (Yes! Completely blind, set up by a coworker, no apps or pictures or anything more than a "she's cute, I think you'll like her.") It was fun. Kind of exhilarating. Now I've stil thought of my ex. But the river is drying. I haven't called her. Progress. I don't think it's simply me replacing my feelings for one person for another. I think time is a prime factor, too. But it helps to kiss a pretty person who thinks you're cool.
To be honest, sp00ns, I feel a little guilty using hubski as my personal journal. It somehow lowers the high bar set by our science, technology, and political reportage. Another part of me feels that there's a universality about our daily grinding pain that's just as relevant as science and technology posting. And if there has to be pain, let's serve it up with music and Disney characters! It's much more fun that way. note to hubski: you can block #stateofthelil
I consider it a branch of #philosophy, frankly.part of me feels that there's a universality about our daily grinding pain that's just as relevant as science and technology posting.
Can something be learned from your thoughtful discussion of your personal life? I think the answer is a clear yes, making it very appropriate for Hubski. I enjoy reading your posts and think I learn from them.
Lately I've been conversing a lot more with, for lack of a better term, an ex. It's actually really great, because we really understand each other well, but all the stuff that drove each other crazy is irrelevant because we aren't and never will be a couple again. I'm not sure if that's relevant to your post, lil. I hope you don't mind me sharing here.
I had one ex, we were together for two years, didn't see each other for 6 months and then had additional 2 years of casual sex and going out. I think the time needed depends on how it all "ended". I don't think that it ever ends. Somebody that has been part of your life for so long, shared such amazing moments with can't just be forgotten, erased from our existence. It is however hard to let them back into your life, depending on how strong the trust break was. In my case, there was barely any break of trust so it was relatively easy to become friends again. In a case where the relationship ends, for example, due to someone cheating, the break of trust is pretty strong and it will take longer to forgive (unless you realize that the majority of us are forced into monogamous relationships while many are actually polyamorous).
You wrote: Absolutely relationships can really really end. Memory takes work. You have to water those memories with longing for them to stay alive. You can sometimes remember that you had an amazing experience -- but you can't feel the feeling you had for that person. It gets kind of sad anyway, and you'd rather move on to feeling the feelings in real time with a new person who shares the feelings with you. The issue I think is this: When our hearts finally open and we feel deeply for someone, we like to hold on to that big passion and do, until someone else comes along that we can transfer the big passion to. This is why, for some people, after a breakup they want to have as many new and random sexual experiences as possible -- just to loosen the hold that the big passion has on them. You start to replace it with smaller passions and heartbreaks which are more manageable than the devastation of losing the big passion. Among the many things, loosely termed shit lil says is this: If you've had at least one big, crazy, wrong-headed passion in your life that doesn't end in broken glass, then it's been a good run.Somebody that has been part of your life for so long, shared such amazing moments with can't just be forgotten, erased from our existence.
shit lil says always makes me think. In this discussion I feel like I can't answer your experience with my experiments. I am a "late" bloomer with only one long-term relationship and dozens of relationships from casual sex to polyamorous lets try this out's. I feel weird nowadays. I don't know what I want from a relationship or if I want a relationship at all. I cut the ropes to my casual sex partners because I either lost interest or they wanted more than I felt. I miss this feeling I had during my first relationship and fear that I will never have it again (4 years since it ended).
This feeling that you miss - that feeling of intensity, passion, and excitement for one person - you may not have quite that again, although you might. You might have a deeper one that grows out of loss and gratitude. I've been saying for a long time that sex is easy, but feelings are hard. After several heartbreaks we might learn to protect our heart in various ways. One of those ways is to be more careful. Love, as you've discovered, is a vast territory, but in the Venn diagram of love, sex, time, and place the overlapping bits seem to grow smaller. When we try to make it wider - with what I call "concurrent monogamy" (as opposed to serial monogamy), you might be left with less genuine connection, rather than more. Like when you have homes in two cities, do you live anywhere? To feel a oneness with someone, you need to be present with them, and they with you, presence as a natural not forced or prescribed way of being You stop and lie down in a divine and circumscribed zone of acceptance, yet opening into worlds of possibility. The possibility of identities dissolving into oneness flowing from individuation to oneness to individuation to sameness to difference and back to oneness in those moment after moments you feel connected, accepted maybe, somehow understood without a lot of pre-judgements about who you are or might be not sex, not only sex, but what I call full-contact conversation. "Magic happens outside of our comfort zones." (read this today as I will likely take it down tomorrow.) _refugee_
That was a great discussion. I think it's in pm. I can't find it. Can you? Maybe it was posted? Text? Private email? Buried in some other shit? I had an interesting response from bf as well. He said something like "a bootie call doesn't stop the loneliness." What's the difference between a bootie call and a relationship? Do you want to make it a post?
There are so many variables. For my friend and I, it took about five years to be what is consider "good" friends. But we have the advantage of both knowing, clearly and unambiguously, that what we had before will not happen again. I think that helps. How things ended wasn't any real betrayal, either. There were hurt feelings, but it wasn't awful. Change any of those variables and it'll change that timing or the willingness to even want to talk. I think I'm the only one of her exes she still talks to.